Hi

I would happily like the money to go to the developer,
but not have to pay VAT.
Could anybody recommend a reseller maybe in the USA
that I could buy Moi 3.0 (digital download) from and not have to Pay VAT
Or any online site offering it at a good price

Thanks for any help

Philip Moyles

Hi Philip - if it's required by your country to pay VAT then anyone who sells it to you is supposed to charge it. The order service that I use for handling payments does that automatically.

I don't know if any reseller does not collect VAT like they are supposed to, you might ask Novedge.

- Michael

Hi Michael, Do you know how they work out the VAT in the USA ?

Here in the UK the person selling the goods has to have an annual turnover greater than the VAT threshold or if they look as if they are going to breach that limit calculated on a quarterly basis. So even if your suppliers charge VAT on the goods they provide you can not pass that tax on to your clients unless you have met the criteria to charge VAT.

So my question is does the UK VAT inspector take your annual turnover or that of the reseller, or maybe even both, do you know ?

I only ask as i do buy some bits from the states and often don't get charged VAT.

Martin
(TpwUK)

Hi Martin, we don't have an exact equivalent to VAT here in the USA.

But it's not the USA that is demanding the tax, it's the EU - it's part of EU law that imports are taxed and the law is set up so that it's the purchaser's location (not the seller's location) that determines the VAT tax due.

I don't know many really specific details of it myself though - I use an order service called BlueSnap that handles all the details for me. The are a company that specializes in online purchases and have been doing it for a long time so I'm confident they are collecting it properly.


> Here in the UK the person selling the goods has to have an annual turnover greater
> than the VAT threshold or if they look as if they are going to breach that limit calculated
> on a quarterly basis.

I'm certain that BlueSnap as an entire company is well over that threshold - when you purchase MoI you are actually purchasing it from BlueSnap, my company itself does not charge your card directly, BlueSnap does and then they take a small percentage of that.

The reason why I use a service like that is I don't want to spend all my time figuring out details such as how to collect VAT tax and where to send it, currency exchange, etc... etc... , BlueSnap handles all that for me.


> I only ask as i do buy some bits from the states and often don't get charged VAT.

Yes, some companies don't collect it even though it's required, probably in cases like that the burden is supposed to be on you to pay it yourself directly to your government I suppose. Something like that anyway. It's not too likely to be enforced I guess.

If you have any specific questions about it, you'd probably need to ask BlueSnap since they are the ones dealing with it, they have a contact e-mail at support@bluesnap.com and they have a brief FAQ about it here: http://home.bluesnap.com/ecommerce/support/shopper/shopper-faqs#11


> So my question is does the UK VAT inspector take your annual turnover or that of the
> reseller, or maybe even both, do you know ?

I'd think that they'd look at the annual turnover of BlueSnap since they are the ones that actually takes the money. It's doubtful that the origin of the goods being sold beyond the point of sale has anything to do with the VAT threshold...

- Michael

Thanks for the great answer Michael :)

I knew it was to do with the EU eurocrats moaning about loosing too much trade to the USA where you don't have VAT, and they complained bitterly and threatened trade embargoes unless the USA started to bill it and collect it. Such a shame really as it gave us europeans a good saving once upon a time. Personally I don't mind paying the VAT, but it goes without saying, if i can avoid doing so then i will.

Martin
(TpwUK)

Hi

Thanks for all your help
I suppose it is like another form of import tax, but can you really see firms in
the USA being answerable to the UK inland revenue/ Customs and excise for not sending
the 20% from 1 sale of MOI how would they police that?
How do they know that this transaction has taken place.
Just imagine how this process could be abused.
In conclusion I will not pay VAT on this transaction if I buy from overseas
It is the principal of the thing to me, and without principals I would be using pirated software
instead of legitimately buying it.

Thanks again

Philip Moyles

Do you have a friend in the States that could purchase it for you ?

Martin
(TpwUK)

Hi Philip,

> I suppose it is like another form of import tax, but can you really see firms in
> the USA being answerable to the UK inland revenue/ Customs and excise for not sending
> the 20% from 1 sale of MOI how would they police that?

Yes, it's likely to be difficult to enforce in many cases.

Yet it is still the law and companies like BlueSnap which has their entire focus of their whole company on processing money transactions would probably be easier targets for them to focus on.

So I suspect that is why BlueSnap is very strict about complying with the your country's tax code.

But this is not something that BlueSnap is deciding to do on their own - it is your own country that has demanded that this tax is due, they are the ones that you would need to complain to about those rules.

Sorry for the difficulty,

- Michael

Hi Martin, also I found out that the minimum annual turnover threshold that you were talking about earlier does not apply to "nonresident sellers".

See item #2 in this article here:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/janetnovack/2014/05/15/european-vat-10-things-online-sellers-need-to-know-about-taxes-on-digital-goods-and-services/

- Michael

Thanks for the link, it makes for an interesting read. Personally I think that the EU is deliberately trying to price the USA out of the european market space. For instance, I purchased some RAM that i could no longer get anywhere in the UK other than second hand ones. The cost was aprrox £73, but then postage was applied, then customs and excise duties were applied by the couriers and then the VAT by the time this was all done my bank account was £135 the lighter :/

Still works out cheaper than purchasing from Germany but the perceived pain value is far greater now when purchasing from the USA.

This snippet for amusement factor only ... My RAM was coming from PA and i thought it would have gone to the nearest international airport to make its merry way across the pond, but ohhh no, i have watched my parcel do the grand tour of the USA where its final port of call before the UK was California. It took it just over a week to make it ways across the USA so i guess it went by road despite having paid for priority international shipping - lol

Martin
(TpwUK)

Went to buy from Novetek $279 no vat
I set up delivery address, Name e.t.c
it accepted my UK location
when i went to checkout
even though it was digital delivery
display came up

"We are sorry online purchase is not available to United Kingdom
Click on order by Fax button?"

So possibly Novatek would rather lose the sale
than be an unpaid tax collector for the UK revenue
and i see there point.

I could not find the Fax button on there site
even if I did I would not use it.

Sorry that this thread is a distraction,
but don't get me started that the government gets 20% of ALL VET fees
if either of my dogs get sick.

I will buy Moi within the next week, and will spend that time
trying to find the deal I want

PS I purchased and am a licensed user of Rhino 4.0 and rather than upgrade to release 5
I have decided to Buy Moi 3.0 instead.

Best regards to All

Thanks again

If you live in UK,
here is offer from Germany, all legal and price is final/vat included.

Buy Moi3d form here

Hi audio2

here an "alternative" discussion made some time ago

http://moi3d.com/forum/messages.php?webtag=MOI&msg=7081.1

It was sad when Michael blocked the thread... :) :)

When I purchased MoI, the Country selection box accidentally rolled-over from UK to Uganda and it wasn't until it was too late that I noticed I hadn't been charged VAT.


Martin.

To Conclude

Tried to find a seller from the USA
but nothing doing.

So bought from the UK

Reseller
CAD Software Direct
£175 plus £35 Vat (Bummer)
Total £210

Totally happy with my purchase

Cheers Michael


Philip Moyles

novedge?

http://www.novedge.com/brands/94