Hi Michael,

I haven't read the whole thread yet but i want to ask a specific question that accrues to me at this point.
Is there an option to determine the resolution of how the curved faces are being split up (how many increments in the curve) when importing the skp file?

This geometry would be quite simple to do in sketchup from scratch, but I'm worried about the amount of resulting faces. In sketchup I would be able to determine how many segments the arch will be made of, e.g. 12 sides or 24 or 36, depending on the required detail.

I'm new here and I love the MoI already great software! Thanks for doing this!

Hi Bruell, welcome to the forum and to MoI!

> Is there an option to determine the resolution of how
> the curved faces are being split up (how many increments
> in the curve) when importing the skp file?

Yes - when you export to .skp format, the Meshing options dialog will be shown which has various options for controlling the density.

More details on how the meshing options work here:
http://moi3d.com/1.0/docs/moi_command_reference10.htm#meshdialog


By moving the slider or adjusting the other options you can generate either a coarse low-polygon version of your MoI object to the .skp file, or generate a higher detailed but heavier version for something like a final rendering.

MoI works on curved objects so it is kind of different than SketchUp - when you create a circular type object in MoI it is an actual circular object so you don't have to decide at creation time how many sides you want it to have, you can decide that later on when you export to a polygon-based file format.

That allows you to export many different density versions of your same base MoI object, you don't have to specify the density at creation time unlike what you are used to doing in SketchUp. The bad part about doing it at creation time is that it kind of "locks in" that density for that shape and it is not typically easy to go back later on and change it since SketchUp only knows about lines, it doesn't know that a bunch of lines actually initially came from a circle...


> This geometry would be quite simple to do in sketchup from scratch

Yeah, it's not a complex model so doing it from scratch in almost anything is certainly not out of the question.

However, a model like this that involves cutting several pieces by profile curves will come together extremely fast in MoI, probably something like only 1 minute to completely finish that shape from scratch. Maybe I will have to make a video to really show what I am talking about here...

But don't get me wrong - SketchUp has its own different kinds of strengths and speed in different kinds of situations as well.

- Michael

Hi Bruell, just to give you a better idea of the speed that I was talking about, here is a realtime screen-capture video that shows how to build this shape in MoI - total modeling time is only 1 min 17 sec.

It would be interesting to know if you could build that in Sketchup in the same amount of time, do you think it is possible?

Download video (1.8MB) or play below:




- Michael

Hi Michael
Yes I believe that is possible in less one minute ! ;)
But a little training is necessary
and for this particular form Symmetry will be a big help!

Hi Pilou, it would be great to see the steps!

But you know, 1 minute and 17 seconds goes by really quickly, are you sure you can do it in that amount of time? :)

I'm not familiar with a symmetry tool in SketchUp - is that a plugin?

- Michael

Yes there is the mirror plug!
Rest is only dexterity ;)

Take me 5 minutes i draw you the concept ;)

Here the concept without special plug except mirror!

Speed will be made by Selection (spacebar) Push selection by "P"
The "X Push" is the normal push without special plugin : here it's very easy because you have not a lot of rectangles
so made in a three seconds!


Mirror plug (Right click on a selection) http://www.crai.archi.fr/RubyLibraryDepot/Ruby/EM/Mirror_31.rb




Ps the normal symmetry of a selection is : select anything
take the "Scale Tool"
Take a "cube green handle" make "any move" (of any distance) with it : release it
but now Enter "-1" = you have a symmetry ;)

Hi Pilou, your solution looks good!

I'm not that used to Push/Pull in SketchUp so it doesn't really occur to me to use it like a boolean to cut something all the way through, but it does work fine for that.

Only 2 problems - #1 you're using a plugin instead of the "stock" SketchUp! (the solution in MoI is only using all standard built-in tools), and #2 - you appear to have extra edges in your result running down the middle of the model, I guess to get a fully clean result those would also need to be deleted as an extra step?

Also how long does it take?

Here is a new record from me, with some faster mouse clicking I get 59 seconds:

No the "Edge line" on the top is like "lines seams generator" in nurbs ;)
It's only Edge Style drawing!

For the rapidity I believe that I can made all this forms in less than 30 seconds ;)
But only because it's a very simple symmetric form !

If you don't want use the extra plug mirror : you must make a Copy Move + the Scale "-1" (shown and explained above)
so maybe 5 seconds more !

But use plugs is a normal way in sketchup ;)

Hi Pilou, I'm trying your steps in SketchUp, but as far as I can tell you can only push/pull one single outline at a time, is that correct?

I mean you show one step in your instructions, but is that actually 5 different push/pulls, one to cut each rectangle? Or am I missing a way to do multiple simultaneous push/pull ?

re: 30 seconds - I await your video to show it! That much time goes by very fast, so you may be surprised...

Your steps definitely look good though (except not using stock SketchUp!), but also what if the number of holes grows? I think it could be quite tedious to form each hole by an individual push/pull action.

I mean something like this for instance in MoI can be booleaned by selecting all the cutting objects in one boolean operation:





So for example that is 21 holes cut with one boolean in MoI.

- Michael

Yes without extra plug you must make only one surface "Push Pull" in the same time!

But........
There is the genial "Joint Push Pull" (free) by Freddo 6 ( a french guy ;) who made that you show in one pass!
http://www.crai.archi.fr/RubyLibraryDepot/Ruby/JointPushPull.zip


For the video I am rusted (no computer for 2 weeks) but trust me I can made that in a few days ;)

Ps A True Boolean plug is released by Whaat! (not free 10 $ ) http://www.smustard.com/script/BoolTools

Hi Pilou - after trying your solution one other kind of general problem sort of jumps out at me which is such a heavy reliance on mirroring multiple times.

That level of mirroring tends to require a lot more planning and is kind of less of a dynamic sketching/drawing kind of feel...

When you look at the solution I do in MoI, it seems to be to stay more recognizable and sort of "whole" during the entire process.

Your one in SketchUp feels really quite a lot less like natural drawing, to me at least!

- Michael

Yes and there are faces "inside" who are created and must maybe erased by another plugin ;)
(DB tools Clean selection)

mmm....a MoI, Sketchup showdown....interesting :)

Can you do it while cross eyed ! ;)

---------

Hi Pilou,

> Yes without extra plug you must make only one
> surface "Push Pull" in the same time!

I see - but that means that you were not including all steps in your progression you showed above, you made 5 steps look like 1 step there!

The other thing I noticed is the move * 5 part - I didn't even know you could do that in SketchUp so that is interesting, but it seems that you have to apply the * 5 only after you have copied one item, so you don't really get a chance to dynamically see all 5 items and be able to adjust the spacing with them with the mouse? Unless I am missing something about how it works?

Notice in my video that you get dynamic feedback of the items while in the Array Dir command.

That's actually another part that just feels more dynamic and actually more like drawing for the MoI method for this particular model.

- Michael

Of course I have resumed in "words" in my schema concept else image will be too big!
(5 "push" in the same drawing ;)

The "*" or the "/" are very interesting because that works also for the rotations !

That is very similar to the Array Dir but of course without the "dynamic fead back" ! More rustic!

You must know at the start some measures!

Hi Pilou,

> You must know at the start some measures!

Not if you want to just do a quick sketch!

More dynamic feedback tends to help a lot when you are primarily trying to just quickly draw some idea you had in your head.

- Michael

Hi Pilou, new record in MoI using keyboard shortcuts = 40 seconds! (screen capture video below)

I believe I have fewer steps to complete than you do, so I suspect it will be a lot more difficult than you think to get your version down to 30 seconds... See if you can prove me wrong! ;)

I think you will be surprised how fast 30 seconds actually goes by.

- Michael

You have also some speedy shortcuts ;)

Double-click inside a surface = select the surface + around lines of this surface
(used for select the "rectangle")

"M" + Ctrl = copy + move (used for copy twice the "rectangle" before the "/" between them )

Triple click = Select all (used for the last mirror)

Now I must make some training for have any "idle times" :)

Hi Pilou - but what is your current time to complete your method?

Maybe you can just time it with a stopwatch instead of making a screen capture, just to get an idea.

- Michael