Full Version: V5 beta May-22-2022 available now

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Thanks Frederick! Also in case you haven't seen there is a method in v5 currently for storing general project notes inside a .3dm file. You can access it using File > Notes.

- Michael

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Hi Michael,

So what is missing is a way for a script to access a particular piece of that meta-data?

Frederick

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Hi Frederick, yeah the problem is that the notes is just one big glob of text so it's not very easy for a script to work with.

The part that I would like to add is a mechanism to put in "Document user data" that would be stored with a key name/value pairs so a script could have its own separate data channel that won't get stomped on by other scripts too easily.

- Michael

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Hi Michael,

OK since I really need that you can work on it next.

Drat, this forum doesn't have emojis - so imagine a couple of dozen "grins" follow the sentence above.

Frederick

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My MoI4 background and gridline colors seem to have been altered (by MoI5 beta ???), to dark grey colors.
I do not think that I did anything to cause this. (?)

- Brian

(And MoI3 as well.)

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Hi Brian, it seems to be some side effect from the new theme support in v5, I'll see if I can figure out what settings in moi.ini are getting re-used that maybe should be separate settings in v5 or something.

- Michael

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Thank you Michael.
In MoI4, I manually reset the View Background color to R210, G 223, B 225,
and Locked Objects color to 171, 171, 171,
which are the values used in MoI5 beta default color. Presumably the same as the old MoI 4 colors.
All is well.
I think that the MoI4 gridline colors were not altered. (?)

- Brian

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Thanks Michael.

The new UI and Group capabilities are going to be a big help when teaching!

It just keeps getting better and better! :)

Tom Meeks

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Hi Michael,

Currently :
- Clicking on a object in a group once selects the group
- Clicking again on the same object selects just that object

Correct?

I have a couple of ideas.

1. Allow selecting that behavior (group then object) or the reverse (object then group)

2. Allow holding down some key to control that behavior. Key up you get it one way, key down the other. Just to eliminate the need for a second click

Thanks.

Frederick

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Hi Frederick,

re:
> Currently :
> - Clicking on a object in a group once selects the group
> - Clicking again on the same object selects just that object
>
> Correct?

Yes, it's similar to the "drill in" behavior that's been in place for selecting edge or face sub-objects of solids since MoI version 1.


> I have a couple of ideas.
>
> 1. Allow selecting that behavior (group then object) or the reverse (object then group)
>

I don't think I've seen any programs that function in the reverse order. Do you know of any examples?

It's kind of the most essential function of groups that it makes a set of objects stay together and that means starting with the topmost whole group being selected on the first click.


> 2. Allow holding down some key to control that behavior. Key up you get it one way, key down
> the other. Just to eliminate the need for a second click

What key would you propose for doing that? I'm not sure that there are any that are not already serving some other purpose.

- Michael

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Hi Michael

I understand that my suggestion to reverse the order is a bit odd which is why I suggest making it an option.

Based on my use of MOI most of the time I am going to be manipulating an object, not a group.

So that means a lot of extra clicks, especial if I have 3 or 4 levels of nesting.

Would it be hard to allow both drill-down and "drill-up"?

My goal is not to make your work harder.

Forget the key idea, too many to remember already.

Thanks.

Frederick

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Hi Frederick,

re:
> Based on my use of MOI most of the time I am going to be manipulating an object, not a group.

I guess I'd ask why put it in a group then if you don't want it to behave like a group?

Maybe you need some other organization method separate from groups like "folders" where you can select an entire folder using the scene browser but when you click on objects in the viewport they will select as individual items.


> Would it be hard to allow both drill-down and "drill-up"?

I'm not sure. It would probably have some difficulty co-existing with other selection mechanisms like edge/face drill in on solids.

If your initial click on a solid in a group selected the solid, then if your next click on it would do "drill up" to target the parent group that would mean you could not drill in to select edges or faces of the solid.


- Michael

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Hi Michael.

I see the problem - "drill up" simply won't work.

How about a way to enable/disable just drilling down into a group?

When disabled it would behave like it does now, it selects the object clicked on?

Controlled perhaps by two different user selectable keys (including the usual alt/ctrl/shift bits)? Or one that toggles? How about "scroll lock"? I've always wanted to use that key. <grin>

Mostly I design machines that consist of assemblies, of assemblies, of assemblies, etc. Without actually converting a past project for V5 and working with it, I envision a lot of clicking that becomes annoying. Maybe that would not be the case.

And the idea of "Groups" sounded so simple in my mind.

Frederick

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OK another group question but not about the drill down.

How do you add a new object to an existing group?

How do you remove an existing object from a group or move it to another group?

Thanks.

Frederick

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Hi Frederick,

re:
> How do you add a new object to an existing group?

Select the object and then click on the group name in the "Objects" section of the scene browser.


> How do you remove an existing object from a group

Select the existing object and use either Ungroup to move it out of its current group and up one level in the hierarchy, or use UngroupAll to completely remove it from the entire hierarchy in one shot.


> or move it to another group?

Select the object and then click on the group name in the "Objects" section of the scene browser.

- Michael

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Hi Frederick,

re:
> Controlled perhaps by two different user selectable keys (including the usual alt/ctrl/shift bits)?

There are not 2 keys available out of alt/ctrl/shift - ctrl + click is used for deselection, shift + click is used for multiple selection if "Multiple selection: Only with Shift key" is set.

Alt is a possibility but Alt+drag is used for view navigation and trying to use it also for selection will degrade the view navigation a little because it will have to wait to see if you're doing a drag or a click before it can do anything.

Maybe I can make double click drill all the way down to the bottom. I don't like double click all that much though I have tried to avoid using it but that means it is open currently.

Maybe another thing that could happen with the double click method is that after you've done it on one item in a group the group could go into a type of "full drill down mode" and any further single clicks on anything within the same hierarchy would select objects directly and not any intermediate groups. When selection is cleared off of everything in the group "full drill down mode" could turn off.

- Michael

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Hi Michael,

When I posted "keys" I was thinking of the normal keys (a to z, etc) plus the possible alt/ctrl/shift modifiers - just like you already use for "short cut keys".

I tend to agree about double-clicking. It adds a "timing element" which is not real user friendly.

Frederick

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Hi Michael,

Well, that works just fine.

Here I was looking around for ADD and MOVE commands.

Frederick

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Hi Frederick,

re:
> When I posted "keys" I was thinking of the normal keys (a to z, etc) plus the possible
> alt/ctrl/shift modifiers - just like you already use for "short cut keys".

That would unfortunately be completely undiscoverable because it is very uncommon for a program to use a "normal key" being held down to modify mouse clicking behavior.


> I tend to agree about double-clicking. It adds a "timing element" which is not real user friendly.

It is a good fit for this particular thing though because 2 individual clicks will already drill in.

- Michael

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Hi Michael,

I wasn't thinking of holding a key down, just using a key in the same way that "short cut" keys are used, to invoke an action.

Only this one key would toggle between if "group drill down" was in effect or if "just select the object clicked on" was in effect.

If toggle keys are "bad" then use two to select would "mode" is in effect.

Sorry for being unclear in what I was trying to convey.

Frederick

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