First impressions of a new user (MOI vs Autodesk123d)

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 From:  nickax
7474.1 
Excellent !

I mean, really good - I'm very impressed - I've been struggling for a fortnight with Autodesk 123D which has very unintuitive UI, heavily compromised by an attempt to provide touch/tablet support.

I climbed a long way up its learning curve - but there are many annoyances and seemingly several actual bugs (moving points don't snap to grids, tool palettes can't be moved, many operations simply 'don't work' - actually because the geometry hasn't snapped properly and things do not lie on the plane or line you think they do.)
Other annoyances are the ludicrous 'highlight' of selected objects - (which makes them very slightly darker cyan), and the 'depressed' (read 'greyed out') operation buttons which actually represent the operation in progress) - They so nearly made something brilliant - and actually because of half a dozen problems made something terrible.

So - coming to MOI ... love the UI - the multiple viewports, nice menus - simple, well presented, consistent layout - powerful operations, that work, first time, just the way you'd expect.

I have to temper all this praise with one criticism - which was that for about an hour last night, once my model got a little bit complicated I started running into the threading problem with the viewports - This causes all sorts of extremely weird and very frustrating behaviour - one clue is the overlaid viewport captions - but also lighting fails, picking and panning goes crazy and artefacts are rendered into the 'wrong' viewports. Editing the .INI file and setting the threading limit to one immediately solved all the problems - (but you really need to fix this in the interests of gaining customers)

I will make the very most of my 30 day trial - as a hobbyist/inventor, it's difficult to justify the $295 + VAT, but I might just spring for it (and certainly will if any of my inventions take off) - Just wish there was some sort of pay-as-you-go licensing model. Check out my own on-line snooker game http://www.quicksnooker.com I know a bit about how hard it is to make software pay (and had to get a 'real job' again).

One more thing (a suggestion/feature request) - could we have the ADWS keys move the camera - left, right, in and out - combined with (holding) right mouse button to 'look' - it would let us 'walk around' our models in the 'first person shooter' mode (our youth are so familiar with) .. my models aren't even the architectural type this would be most suited to - but it's a paradigm millions of people are familiar with.

Many thanks

PS let me know if you're hiring ;o)
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 From:  Michael Gibson
7474.2 In reply to 7474.1 
Hi Nick - thanks I'm really glad that you are liking MoI!

Can you tell me what kind of video card you have on your machine that did not deal with the threaded display mechanism very well? Maybe problems in that area are getting more common than they used to be, I'll have to think about maybe having it off by default rather than on by default.

re: First person shooter mode - you can switch the regular mouse viewport manipulation into first person mode, go to Options > View > Rotate/Pan/Zoom options, and change the "Rotation style" at the top of that dialog to Rotation style = "First person". Then you'll probably want to switch it back when you're done looking around.

- Michael
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 From:  nickax
7474.3 In reply to 7474.2 
Hi Micheal

My system is my 3 year old work laptop .. it's a pretty modest spec..

Nick


------------------
System Information
------------------
Time of this report: 7/1/2015, 21:39:54
Machine name: NICK-HP
Operating System: Windows 7 Professional 64-bit (6.1, Build 7601) Service Pack 1 (7601.win7sp1_gdr.150525-0603)
Language: English (Regional Setting: English)
System Manufacturer: Hewlett-Packard
System Model: HP 630 Notebook PC
BIOS: Default System BIOS
Processor: Intel(R) Core(TM) i3 CPU M 370 @ 2.40GHz (4 CPUs), ~2.4GHz
Memory: 8192MB RAM
Available OS Memory: 7990MB RAM
Page File: 9013MB used, 6964MB available
Windows Dir: C:\Windows
DirectX Version: DirectX 11
DX Setup Parameters: Not found
User DPI Setting: Using System DPI
System DPI Setting: 96 DPI (100 percent)
DWM DPI Scaling: Disabled
DxDiag Version: 6.01.7601.17514 64bit Unicode

------------
DxDiag Notes
------------
Display Tab 1: No problems found.
Sound Tab 1: No problems found.
Input Tab: No problems found.

--------------------
DirectX Debug Levels
--------------------
Direct3D: 0/4 (retail)
DirectDraw: 0/4 (retail)
DirectInput: 0/5 (retail)
DirectMusic: 0/5 (retail)
DirectPlay: 0/9 (retail)
DirectSound: 0/5 (retail)
DirectShow: 0/6 (retail)

---------------
Display Devices
---------------
Card name: Intel(R) HD Graphics
Manufacturer: Intel Corporation
Chip type: Intel(R) HD Graphics (Core i3)
DAC type: Internal
Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_8086&DEV_0046&SUBSYS_3674103C&REV_02
Display Memory: 1696 MB
Dedicated Memory: 64 MB
Shared Memory: 1632 MB
Current Mode: 1366 x 768 (32 bit) (60Hz)
Monitor Name: Generic PnP Monitor
Monitor Model: unknown
Monitor Id: LGD02AD
Native Mode: 1366 x 768(p) (59.636Hz)
Output Type: Internal
Driver Name: igdumd64.dll,igd10umd64.dll,igdumdx32,igd10umd32
Driver File Version: 8.15.0010.2622 (English)
Driver Version: 8.15.10.2622
DDI Version: 10
Driver Model: WDDM 1.1
Driver Attributes: Final Retail
Driver Date/Size: 1/10/2012 23:28:32, 8313856 bytes
WHQL Logo'd: Yes
WHQL Date Stamp:
Device Identifier: {D7B78E66-4306-11CF-B279-7E16A2C2C535}
Vendor ID: 0x8086
Device ID: 0x0046
SubSys ID: 0x3674103C
Revision ID: 0x0002
Driver Strong Name: oem40.inf:IntelGfx.NTamd64.6.0:iILKM0:8.15.10.2622:pci\ven_8086&dev_0046
Rank Of Driver: 00E62001
Video Accel: ModeMPEG2_A ModeMPEG2_C ModeWMV9_B ModeWMV9_C ModeVC1_B ModeVC1_C
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 From:  Michael Gibson
7474.4 In reply to 7474.3 
Thanks for posting those specs Nick - I guess it seems to be Intel graphics that tend to have the problems with the threaded display code.

- Michael
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 From:  nickax
7474.5 In reply to 7474.4 
Thanks for the advice re FPS mode.. the 'look' function works nicely - now all I want is the 'walk'

so.. help me out here :)









Like I say, most of us have played an FPS at some point and I have a reflex action to go to AWSD keys to 'walk around' - We don't all have tablets or pens and it just seems like (if they're not assigned to anything else) they should be the default keys for panning ?
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 From:  Michael Gibson
7474.6 In reply to 7474.5 
Hi Nick,

> it just seems like (if they're not assigned to anything else) they should be the default keys for panning ?

The shortcut key philosophy for MoI is to keep the default set to be quite lean and small and try to keep things open for your own customization. In the future I do want to make it a lot easier to set up shortcut keys with something like a script library that you could browse through more easily.

Check out here for what scripts to use currently for panning or rotating with the arrow keys:

http://moi3d.com/forum/index.php?webtag=MOI&msg=672.4
http://moi3d.com/forum/index.php?webtag=MOI&msg=6145.2
http://moi3d.com/forum/index.php?webtag=MOI&msg=6145.4


The way the panning from scripts work is the script needs to get a hold of a viewport object first, and then on the viewport there's a .pan() method which takes 3 parameters (3rd one optional), for a step factor, first parameter is RightLeft step, second parameter is UpDown step, and optional 3rd parameter is BackwardsForwards step factor.

Hope that gets you set up how you want!

- Michael
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