To BurrMan:
:) I know. This is quite popular actually and it is one of the most important reasons for the mass skepticism when aesthetic issues are discussed.

To omac12:
The subjective element exists of course, nobody could argue about that. We are not machines. But there are also patterns of reactions, emotions and behavior related to the aesthetic factors. Studding and exploiting these patterns is what this science is about. I know it is not easy explain that. There is noting simple and easy about human psychology and aesthetics in that matter. Most people, even some professionals can not even consciously think on that. They have completely spontaneous and emotional approach to this problems. Even if you try to force them to run the most basic aesthetic analysis they'll typically fail by looking for same simple pragmatic explanation related usually to functionality, witch of course has nothing to do with aesthetics, or they will simply give up by stating “everything is about personal taste and that is that!”. Well not everything. We know that know. It is unpleasant for all of us to realize that our reaction about things we don't quite understand very often follow common patterns, but it is true and it is commonly used by developers.

To Michael:
>Well, it's funny you mention that, because I did actually hire a interface professional

Sounds good!

>most people find the UI as a whole to actually be the single biggest positive thing about MoI!

Most people mistake usability aspects of the interface with aesthetic and it is true that the usability aspects of MOI's GUI are quite impressive, but.. not the look.

>Some people seem to like a "dark & depressing", "super professional gloomy gothic"

Ha ha ha well... I can imagine the GUI to look much better than now, without being dark, depressing and gloomy :)

>But frankly, I find it pretty weird that you would completely stay away from using MoI because the color of the UI is not "professional" enough..

I can't be creative in my work if I am distracted unpleasantly by interface and what surrounds me in general. Believe me I am not happy about that at all and I dare to guess that I am not the only one.

>MoI is generally meant to be a tool that is easier for people with less experience to use. If it offends you that MoI has this focus on ease of use and accessibility to "regular people" then it probably is not going to be the right program for you.

Again, try to distinguish the “ease of use” and “accessibility” from aesthetic attractiveness and we will be on the same page. You don't have to sacrifice neither of these. I am talking about upgrading them with better look.

>If it offends you that MoI has this focus on ease of use and accessibility to "regular people" this focus on ease of use and accessibility to "regular people"

I am not certain I understand your point of view. Why I should feel offended of the fact that “this focus on ease of use and accessibility to "regular people"? I and any other user could only appreciate that.

> it probably is not going to be the right program for you.

Still I hope you will consider my suggestion and don't give up on me and many other potential users willing to work with pleasant looking software. Non the less I think MOI deserves that.

Hi Enzo,

> Most people mistake usability aspects of the interface
> with aesthetic and it is true that the usability aspects
> of MOI's GUI are quite impressive, but.. not the look.

I have had feedback from people specifically praising the look and the colors, not just the usability.

Certainly tastes in colors vary and not everyone will be pleased with any single setup.

Because of that fact, it is just not really an area that I have a lot of interest in spending that much time in - no matter what is done to the UI there will always be someone who complains that it does not look nice.

These complaints are very far and few between with MoI, so I have a lot of doubt that this is really a widespread major issue with MoI.

Probably the ideal thing I could do would be to have a couple of different skins to switch between, and maybe in the future I will be able to work on that, but it requires quite a lot of work.


> Ha ha ha well... I can imagine the GUI to look much better
> than now, without being dark, depressing and gloomy :)

Right now it is hard for me to understand something that is currently trapped just in your imagination...

If you have some suggestions or ideas, it would really help a lot if you would make some images to describe them in a more concrete way rather than just making such vague statements.

Your one concrete recommendation to hire a professional has actually already been done...


> I can't be creative in my work if I am distracted unpleasantly
> by interface and what surrounds me in general. Believe me I
> am not happy about that at all and I dare to guess that I am
> not the only one.

Surely you must be exaggerating considerably.

MoI's interface looks pleasant and welcoming, without an "in your face" type look, with easy text readability.

I have a hard time understanding what you would find distracting about it.


> Again, try to distinguish the “ease of use” and “accessibility”
> from aesthetic attractiveness and we will be on the same page.
> You don't have to sacrifice neither of these. I am talking about
> upgrading them with better look.

How specifically would this "upgrade" take place? So far I have seen no images or concrete examples from you.


> I am not certain I understand your point of view. Why I should
> feel offended of the fact that “this focus on ease of use and
> accessibility to "regular people"? I and any other user could
> only appreciate that.

Well, sorry to use this word but most of your complaint seems to be coming from a kind of "pretentious artist who understands style SO much better than other people" kind of a vibe...

That's why it seems like you may be offended by MoI's focus on being more friendly to a wider group of less specialized users rather than targeted at some privileged snobby elite "professional" user...

Sorry, but that's mostly what I get from your statements so far.

If you have something concrete to suggest, by all means show some images or some examples instead of making vague statements.

Try not to exaggerate and claim that MoI's current UI looks so horrible - when you make such grossly exaggerated statements like that it is hard to take what you are saying seriously.

- Michael

Enzo,

There is no room for arrogance, because arrogance does not have a good style.


Michael,

Please do not change the great & unique "Look and Feel". :)

Hi Enzo, also the other thing to be aware of is that the choice of colors and usability can often be intertwined much more than what you seem to think.

I often see usability sacrificed in the name of style particularly with less readable text, for example black text on a dark gray background.

- Michael

Hello,

Enzo, how about a single icon example? It doesn’t need to be polished, just sketch it up and post it to the forum. As someone who has done localization and usability work in the past for some very complex design software I’m interested to see what your ideas entail.

I hope you were joking when you blamed your lack of attention and creativity on a software application interface. Frankly, if that is the case I don’t know how you are able to function.

No, no I wasn't complaining. I am not even surprised of the situation with the interface and everything else. There is no point to continue with this conversation since you can not detect the problem and obviously not taking seriously what I said.

>If you have some suggestions or ideas, it would really help a lot if you would make some images to describe them in a more concrete way rather than just making such vague statements.

My ideas or suggestions will not replace professional consultancy. Finally this is what these people sell for a living – ideas, concepts and strategies. At some point if you realize that aesthetic improvements could be important for MOI see if you could find someone you could trust and contract with him.

Annoying the visitors of this forum is the opposite of my intention so I will not reply further.

Hi Enzo,

> There is no point to continue with this conversation
> since you can not detect the problem and obviously
> not taking seriously what I said.

Well, I guess the only thing I can point out is that I'm not alone - see above for posts from other users who also do not detect the problem as well.

I can certainly understand something like "I prefer a different color scheme", but what you said was more like "the current color scheme hurts my eyes so much I cannot even use MoI", which is just so extremely far away from everyone else's experience that it is difficult to understand.


> My ideas or suggestions will not replace professional
> consultancy. Finally this is what these people sell for a living
> – ideas, concepts and strategies.

As I've already mentioned, that has already been done - the current color scheme is actually the result of collaborating with a professional UI consultant.


At some point in the future it may be possible to have a couple of different color choices, it would probably be the current one and a darker one and my guess from what you have described is that you would prefer a darker one, although it is hard for me to be sure what you want exactly since you have shown nothing concrete to help illustrate.

- Michael

Now,-------

If all the parts of the UI were floatable and rotatable------we would have a Brian UI potential and who then could complain!

He he!

Brian

""""""""This is quite popular actually and it is one of the most important reasons for the mass skepticism when aesthetic issues are discussed.""""""""""""

Enzo,
What's going on for you is you are involved in this particular study "too heavily" and the idea of applied psychology to ANY particular field is made more significant by it's study than it actually is. Your teachers have been using NLP to have your belief inline with the practice. A few years down the road, adn after coming full circle, you may realize that the weight of the importance has been manifested by you.

It truley does not exist!

>super professional gloomy gothic

lololol. he77, i like goth music but I dont dig the dark UI. If you do make one, I suggest calling it "Bela Lugosi Mode" (Bauhaus - Bela Lugosi's Dead). :P

> Well, it's funny you mention that, because I did actually hire a interface professional very early on with MoI to help me design the color scheme

Phffftt! But there's Adobe Kuler. http://kuler.adobe.com Er, well maybe Kuler wasnt around at that time. ;)

Hello,

Enzo, just so I am clear on this, you think it is a good idea for someone else to spend tens/hundreds of thousands of dollars on “specialists” based solely on a serious aesthetic “problem” that only you can see and are unwilling to share? Unless of course you know of “specialists” that are willing to work for 0 and will only be compensated in line with any sales specifically generated from such “improvements” per written contract? Yeah, didn’t think so.

"I can't be creative in my work if I am distracted unpleasantly by interface and what surrounds me in general."

I have to wonder, what NURBS drawing package you will end up being happy with? I'd seriously like to know.

There is no universal definition of aesthetics. That's why we have so many styles of automobiles, clothing, houses, etc.

Not all 3D drawing packages work the same or produce the same result. It's a tool. People generally pick the best tool for the job within their budget.

So, if you are distracted by the MoI UI to the extent you can't be creative, then which 3D drawing software will you choose?

It`s somehow funny,

this thread has absolutely no value .....

but lots of posts ....

all of them on one day.

Are people just waiting and lurking for this kind of nonsense talk to come out of their hideout?


Oh damn i`ve just posted myself.... couldn`t resist....


Arrrgh!

Actually Vince...Most of the posters are daily contributors the the forum...Do you come in much??? Lot's of valuable learning. Even for the original poster!! :o

MoI GUI is good!

Sorry, felt left out :S

Cheers, have a nice day all.

http://www.colorjack.com :)

I could kind of see how one may find the interface a little kiddy, but to rant about it to this extent, no way.

"Do you come in much???" - with and emphasized you?

Hey, you don`t feel offended by my post, do you? :)

But regarding your question:

More often then you think. But i am more a reader then a poster.

But see for yourself in which thread i did post and in which threads i didn`t.
I am a living example for consuming my time with stupid activity and as i can see i am not alone.
There are surely more valuable threads, but where is the traffic ???

If you feel that this thread is of much value to you, than i am sorry for what i`ve posted.

Don`t let the noise in my Head bother you :)

All right guys, kind of getting close to locking the thread, please don't break out into a bunch of side arguments.

- Michael