fillet enhancement?
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 From:  NightCabbage
3287.16 
No problems, understandable :)
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 From:  Brian (BWTR)
3287.17 In reply to 3287.14 
Hi Michael

There was something about a plugin I thought for SketchUp quite recently?
Certainly other than ViaCad?

You may be interested in this about Blender Nurbs.
(A lot more info about)

http://download.blender.org/documentation/oldsite/oldsite.blender3d.org/117_Blender%20tutorial%20Fun%20with%20nurbs.html

Brian
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 From:  Michael Gibson
3287.18 In reply to 3287.17 
Hi Brian,

> There was something about a plugin I thought for SketchUp quite recently?

For actual NURBS surface variable radius fillets? Pretty unlikely, but if you find the link please post it.

You're probably talking about some kind of sweeping technique for generating polygons from some profile curves, that's not the same thing as a fillet.


> Certainly other than ViaCad?

Yeah, it is not unusual (and in fact rather common) in NURBS based CAD programs to have it. But neither SketchUp nor Blender are NURBS based CAD programs.


> You may be interested in this about Blender Nurbs.
> (A lot more info about)

It is interesting! But please note that the tutorial you link to is all about control point manipulation of an untrimmed surface.

That does not particularly have anything to do with variable radius fillet generation.


Maybe you are confused because it refers to "NURBS" as well?

Just be aware that NURBS can sometimes refer to a just a simple surface by itself and not necessarily trims, booleans, fillets, and additional stuff like that.

As far as I know Blender does not support any of those kinds of Trimmed NURBS operations, like booleans for example. Getting those kinds of operations working is a very considerable jump in complexity from basic untrimmed surfaces.

- Michael
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 From:  Frenchy Pilou (PILOU)
3287.19 
You can now in Google Sketchup free make variable fillet as you can make a "sweep" with 4 curves
Extrude Edges by Rail by TIG
http://forums.sketchucation.com/viewtopic.php?f=323&t=23662&start=0#p201286

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Pilou
Is beautiful that please without concept!
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 From:  Michael Gibson
3287.20 In reply to 3287.19 
Hi Pilou, that's nice, but that is not a variable radius fillet that you are showing there.

A variable radius fillet is similar to a regular fillet - it is a new smooth surface that is calculated between 2 existing surfaces, with ensured tangency where the new surface touches the others.

The one you show there is like a sweep - it's not a connection between 2 existing surfaces, and since the output is only polygons there is no kind of tangency in the generated surfaces either...

Here is an example of what a variable radius fillet looks like, the fillet surface is in red:



So note that it is trimming away what used to be a sharp connection between 2 surfaces just like a regular fillet, except that the fillet radius is changing between different values as it travels along the edge.

- Michael

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 From:  Frenchy Pilou (PILOU)
3287.21 In reply to 3287.20 
I understand but with "hard work" that is not possible to approach the same result?
In fact curves must be known before apply function EEbR ;)
Or horizontal transition between them will be definitly impossible?

EDITED: 5 Feb 2010 by PILOU

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 From:  Michael Gibson
3287.22 In reply to 3287.21 
Hi Pilou,

> I understand but with "hard work" that is not possible
> to approach the same result?

I guess in theory yes, if you spend 20 hours working on it or something like that.

But in practicality, no not really.

The difference is that the Fillet is constructed with knowledge of the surrounding surfaces and automatically adapts itself to be smooth to them.


The other thing is the one you show only generates flat polygon pieces, there is not really a true "radius" created there. In a NURBS fillet, each cross-section of the fillet surface is a true exact mathematical arc, not just some lines or polygons arranged to roughly mimic an arc.

- Michael
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 From:  Brian (BWTR)
3287.23 In reply to 3287.20 
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 From:  Michael Gibson
3287.24 In reply to 3287.23 
Hi Brian,

> http://sites.google.com/a/ckbrd.de/blender---nurbs/

That is interesting, but are you aware that it is not a list of features already in Blender? It's a fundraiser and wish list of some potential ideas for the future.

Whichever developer takes up that task will find pretty quickly that Booleans and Fillets are an enormously complex area and cannot be easily coded from scratch without many many man-years of effort just on those areas alone.

- Michael
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 From:  Brian (BWTR)
3287.25 In reply to 3287.24 
Yes!
But have you noted the usually small time frame in Blender between an idea and a fullfillment?
And, keep an eye on 3D Coat in that Nurbs area also.
Brian
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 From:  Michael Gibson
3287.26 In reply to 3287.25 
Hi Brian,

> But have you noted the usually small time frame in Blender
> between an idea and a fullfillment?

Sometimes yes, and sometimes no.

For NURBS it is rather more the "no" case though - this is not even the first time that there has been some attempt at adding more NURBS features into Blender, check out this discussion here from 2003 that is referring to an earlier idea and attempt at adding more NURBS functions into Blender.

It's now 2010 - is that the kind of "small time frame" that you are referring to?

There are a couple of reasons why it is not very realistic to expect to see advanced NURBS functions in Blender.

One is that NURBS booleans and trimmed surface functions are very difficult to implement, if coding them from scratch it requires someone who has a lot of experience in that particular area, not just general coding experience, and even then it requires an investment of many years of work.

Another reason though is that Blender is focused more producing animation and graphics type projects and not very much on precise accurate product design type modeling which is what NURBS is more about. So there is a kind of mismatch in general toolset between those things.


> And, keep an eye on 3D Coat in that Nurbs area also.

Yeah, I think I've seen that he wants to add a NURBS import feature which would be interesting! The discussion thread for that in the 3D-coat forum is here:
http://www.3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=3052&st=0

But again - you may be getting confused - there's a big difference between importing NURBS and doing variable radius filleting modeling functions.

Just because a program implements one particular kind of NURBS feature does not mean it will suddenly have every single kind of difficult NURBS calculation included with it, which seems to be what you are assuming.

- Michael
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 From:  Brian (BWTR)
3287.27 In reply to 3287.26 
Was it just January--

Unreal--Free
Unity---Free
Bullet Physics---Free
Ptex--Free!

Ptex in 3DC now, Bullet even coming in the next version of Carrara.

Brian
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 From:  Michael Gibson
3287.28 In reply to 3287.27 
Hi Brian,
quote:

Was it just January--

Unreal--Free
Unity---Free
Bullet Physics---Free
Ptex--Free!

Ptex in 3DC now, Bullet even coming in the next version of Carrara.

Those things are pretty cool!

But what does that have to do with the topic being discussed here: variable radius NURBS fillets?

- Michael
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 From:  Marc (TELLIER)
3287.29 
> Fillets are an enormously complex area and cannot be easily coded from scratch without many many man-years of effort just on those areas alone

Hi Michael, variable fillets would be cool but if it represents 80 weeks of work to implement, I can easily live without them!

Marc
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 From:  Michael Gibson
3287.30 In reply to 3287.29 
Hi Marc,

> Hi Michael, variable fillets would be cool but if it represents
> 80 weeks of work to implement, I can easily live without them!

In my case it is not as dire as that, because the geometry library that I have licensed does have support for it.

So I do expect to be able to have these once I get a chance to design a UI for it.

The many many years effort would be for someone trying to code them up completely from scratch instead of licensing a library to do it.

- Michael
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 From:  NightCabbage
3287.31 
Ah, in that case, it's a definitely wish list item for a "not too distant update" :P

Good news :)
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