Text and Extrude Command  1-20  21-23

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 From:  naoky
2999.1 
Hi, there.

I found a funny behavior of Moi (v2 beta).
(1) Execute text command (set text string to "Moment").
(2) Select all and execute extrude command.
Only "e" is extruded opposite direction (see attached image).

I'm new to Moi and this forum, so sorry if this issue was already
reported, or if it's a feature.


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 From:  Frenchy Pilou (PILOU)
2999.2 In reply to 2999.1 
Yes seems there is something like a bug with letters who have an internal hole and aespecially the e! ;)

So Type your text as curves and make an extrude with Caps enable or text as solid ;)


EDITED: 19 Oct 2009 by PILOU

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 From:  naoky
2999.3 In reply to 2999.2 
In effect, it's not a problem at all (instead, create text as a solid).
So it may not be a moment of fix (even if it's a bug).
Because I'm a newbie to Moi, I may do what oldie doesn't.
My apologies in advance.
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 From:  naoky
2999.4 In reply to 2999.3 
Additional information:

This behavior depends on font.
In Microsoft Sans Serif font or some Japanese font, there is no problem with "e".
On the other hand, in another Japanese font, "e" is ok but "n" is extruded into the opposite direction.
So the "hole" seems to have nothing to do with this issue.
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 From:  Michael Gibson
2999.5 In reply to 2999.1 
Hi naoky, thanks for reporting this bug!

It seems to be caused by some specific shape in those particular fonts. I tried with about 20 different fonts over here and I could not seem to repeat the problem.

If I can repeat the problem while running over here, it makes it a lot easier to try and debug it.

Could you please let me know the name of the font that you are using there, and also please attach (or e-mail to me at moi@moi3d.com) a 3DM file with the curves in it so I can try to repeat the extrusion problem over here?

Occasionally some fonts have things in them like self-intersections which don't really affect the regular 2D text display (which they were originally designed for) but can mess things up when trying to make them 3D. This could possibly be something related to that, but there is supposed to be a mechanism in the Extrude command that tries to use a consistent direction when extruding a bunch of things all in the same plane. That does not appear to be working in this case, and if I can repeat the problem over here I'll see if I can get it fixed up.

- Michael
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 From:  naoky
2999.6 In reply to 2999.5 
Hi, Michael.

It's my fault to describe inaccurately. They are surfaces, not curves.
I put the texts as surfaces and executed extrude command.

Anyway, I choose 4 fonts which "e" or "n" are extruded into the opposite direction.
The font names are put alongside, from the top, Arial, Century, MS Gothic (Japanese),
and AR Proportional Round Gothic M (Japanese). Please execute extrude command.

I'm really impressed that you make untiring effort to improve Moi.
I'll cooperate with you as possible.
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 From:  naoky
2999.7 In reply to 2999.6 
There is another problem related to font.
(1) Create text as solids (Height = 5, Thickness = 1, for example)
(2) Execute Fillet command (Radius = 0.1, Shape = Circular)
There are some letters which Fillet command takes no effect.
(See attached images, red letters are the ones. I tested two font,
Arial and Century.)






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 From:  Michael Gibson
2999.8 In reply to 2999.7 
Hi naoky, yes unfortunately that will not be unusual to have problems filleting text.

Text characters tend to have a lot of sharp angles, narrow regions, and tight bends in them - those are exactly the kinds of things that create difficulties in filleting. For a fillet to be successful it needs to have enough space for the fillet to fit, and things meeting at sharp angles tends to make difficulties with calculations and intersections of extended parts.

Filleting in general is a complex area that involves many functions such as surface offseting, extensions, and intersections so it is fairly easy for it to get messed up when there is difficulty with any one of those steps.

Probably several of those characters will fillet at a smaller radius value though - usually smaller radius values tends to avoid some problems. So for example I tried the Arial w character and was able to fillet it at a radius of 0.05 .

MoI's filleter is not generally strong enough to handle all font characters, if you need to fillet some more difficult things like that you may need to use one of the more "heavy duty" programs such as SolidWorks, Pro/E, etc...

I should be able to fix the original problem you reported earlier though, it turned out to be 2 bugs and I've nearly tracked them down.

- Michael
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 From:  naoky
2999.9 In reply to 2999.8 
Hi, Michael.

Thank you for the description of difficulties about fillet.
The earlier problem is little, so don't overwork yourself.
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 From:  BurrMan
2999.10 In reply to 2999.9 
Sounds like you know what it is, but just some input here. If I shell it and then extract the back face, it then extrudes normally.
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 From:  Michael Gibson
2999.11 In reply to 2999.6 
Hi naoky, thanks very much for posting the 3DM file with the faces to extrude, that really helps me to track down a problem when I have can repeat it over here.

So it turned out that there were actually 2 different bugs here, and I've fixed them both for the next beta which I should be posting just a bit later today.

The first bug was that when creating Text as surfaces rather than solids, each face that was generated would not necessarily have a consistent normal direction, some could have a normal pointing opposite the others. That should be fixed up now so that they should all be consistent, and pointing in the same direction as the grid's "up" direction that you clicked on to place the text.

Then the second problem was that when extruding faces rather than curves, each face would extrude along its own normal direction, so they would go in different directions if they had different orientations. This was not quite exactly a bug, because having each face extrude along its own normal allows for some extrusions of different faces of a solid in one operation like this:



But what I did for this is to make a special case when you've got a bunch of faces that are all lined up on the same plane like the example in your file. In this case it will make a uniform direction between all of the extrusions now.

Please let me know if you still see any bad behavior with this for the next beta.

- Michael

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 From:  Michael Gibson
2999.12 In reply to 2999.10 
Hi Burr,

> If I shell it and then extract the back face, it then extrudes normally.

Yup, the reason why that works is that when it got turned into a solid with shell, everything got a consistent normal direction at that time since it is possible to automatically determine the "outside" of a solid, which is not really well defined for just an open surface.

When you extract faces out of a solid, the extracted faces maintain the same directions as they were in the solid.

So those steps you did basically unified the normals to a consistent direction.

- Michael
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 From:  BurrMan
2999.13 In reply to 2999.12 
hanks for the response there. I looked but couldnt find it. Didnt you have a command the would flip the normals?
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 From:  naoky
2999.14 In reply to 2999.11 
Thank you Michael, Frenchy and BurrMan.
I feel grateful for spending your time to my newbie problem.
I'm looking forward to the next beta, today!
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 From:  Michael Gibson
2999.15 In reply to 2999.13 
Hi Burr,

> Didnt you have a command the would flip the normals?

Yup, it's named Flip , but there isn't a button for it you need to set up a keyboard shortcut or type it in to use it.

- Michael
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 From:  BurrMan
2999.16 In reply to 2999.15 
Go figure. The flip command is named Flip. Didnt think to look in the commands folder. Doh!
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 From:  Michael Gibson
2999.17 In reply to 2999.14 
The new beta is out now, you can get it from here:
http://moi3d.com/beta.htm

It will take me a bit to collect up all the release notes.

- Michael
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 From:  Frenchy Pilou (PILOU)
2999.18 In reply to 2999.17 
Time limit was near the end point! :D
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 From:  BurrMan
2999.19 In reply to 2999.18 
Suddenly the option box has mucho roomo. Cant wait to see what I find! :)

Thanks Michael.
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 From:  Michael Gibson
2999.20 In reply to 2999.19 
Hi Burr,

> Suddenly the option box has mucho roomo.

Yeah it used to be fixed to a hard coded pixel size on startup. That could be too small if you were on a higher resolution display and had some larger font sizes for the UI text size.

Now it should hopefully adapt better to your font size.

- Michael
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