actually this actually confused me the other day too as every 3d app i have and have used has the Z axis going backwards into space (viewport) not upwards as we currently have it. so i would also like to be able to make it the same as my other apps please

>>as every 3d app i have and have used has the Z axis going backwards into space (viewport) not upwards

You cannot change the axis in MoI version 1, but you can in the current beta:-

Options~ view~ Axis labels:-

Changing them to:-



will result in:-

thank you kindly :)

Hi Steve....

Thanks for the clear explanation :)
I have the latest beta.

-anis

this is why i didnt know that setting was there in the beta :/
you can see the little lines next to 3D view angles well if i click that i get to change the xyz . so ive now changed the z and y \0/ thanks steve

Hi Dave, something seems to be wrong with your installation there, that is definitely not what the Options dialog is supposed to look like.

It almost looks like you may have an older version of the UI strings there...

You might want to uninstall, delete that MoI folder, and then re-install to see if you get fixed up.

Also by any chance have you installed the IE8 beta on your system? That can potentially mess things up as well.

- Michael

no IE on that workstation. i shall remove the folder and try again later and see if it fixes it

Hi....

I have setting my moi3d xzy orietation same as orientation in swx. But when i open a 3dm from moi to swx the orientation is not same. Is this normal and how to solve it ?

Look image below :

Hi Anis,

> I have setting my moi3d xzy orietation same as orientation in swx.
> But when i open a 3dm from moi to swx the orientation is not
> same. Is this normal and how to solve it ?

In MoI changing the axis labels only changes some of the UI - it doesn't actually change any of the data that is written to a file for example. That's normally good because most files formats follow their own particular convention about which directions correspond to x, y, and z.

In 3DM files it is the convention that the Top view is of x/y and z is elevation. That has always been the standard orientation of Rhino and for 3DM.

It looks like SolidWorks in their 3DM importer has decided to preserve the coordinate values, instead of preserving the orientation. Really they should be rotating the data when they import it to preserve the orientation of the data as it was originally defined in the 3DM file, that is with x/y being the Top.

That looks like something that they should fix up in their 3DM importer. Have you checked to see if there are any options that you could enable in their importer to adjust that?

- Michael

Hi Michael...

No, there is no option to set the xyz orientation when import 3dm in swx. I can change it manually, but yes need more steps.

Thanks for your explanation.... ;)

-anis

Hi Anis, also you should have been seeing the exact same issue previously before ever setting the x,y,z axis labels in MoI, is that correct?

- Michael

Hi Michael,

>>also you should have been seeing the exact same issue previously before ever setting the x,y,z axis labels in MoI,

May I ask as to the reason for you placing the option to change the axis in MoI when the output reverts back to a global setting?

Personally it is not something I need to use, but see little point of changing the axis if the output simply stays to a default global setting.

You mention about applications giving the ability to flip/change axis on import, does that mean you will be adding such ability to the import of step/sat/iges files from application that do not use the same orientation as MoI?

- Steve

Hi Steve, it is an interface-level customization thing, it's for people who are used to looking at coordinates and entering numbers while they are modeling.

It allows them to do all those modeling-time operations in the coordinate system of their choice, they basically don't have to try and re-learn which direction is "z" when they type in a point.

But it keeps compatability totally present by not changing how things are actually stored in files.

Each different kind of file format has a different convention for how things are oriented and MoI already does the necessary conversions into those different systems at export time.

If I changed the actual stored data when you changed the labels, it would break all those exports with a kind of "double transform" happening and it would cause all kinds of orientation problems with the exported data.


> You mention about applications giving the ability to flip/change
> axis on import, does that mean you will be adding such ability
> to the import of step/sat/iges files from application that do not
> use the same orientation as MoI?

Sure, if that is an actual problem that people are encountering.

But for example I can't remember ever seeing an IGES part that was not oriented with Z-Up, I'm not quite sure if it is absolutely specified to be that in the IGES spec but it is certainly the standard convention.

I've got some IGES parts from SolidWorks before and they seem to remap their coordinates to fit the standard convention there during their export.

Similarly they should pay attention to the standard convention of the 3DM coordinate system when they read 3DM data.

If I started exporting 3DM files with the actual data in it having the x,y,z axes in different directions than normal, it would come in as the wrong orientation in all the other 3DM importers out there that do properly follow the standard convention.

Except for in this one specific case, it would be a big transfer disaster to actually change the stored data when you changed your axis labels.

It is totally fine if another program wants to use a different coordinate system during their run-time, they just have to remap the data from the file's standard orientation to their own.

- Michael

Hi Michael,

>But for example I can't remember ever seeing an IGES part that was not oriented with Z-Up, I'm not quite sure if it is absolutely specified >to be that in the IGES spec but it is certainly the standard convention.
>I've got some IGES parts from SolidWorks before and they seem to remap their coordinates to fit the standard convention there during their >export.

There is no re-mapping on export of iges from solidworks, it is just a case that in SW Y is up, Z if forward, the output is simply xyz co-ordinates, so when imported into MoI then Z is up.


>Similarly they should pay attention to the standard convention of the 3DM coordinate system when they read 3DM data

SW reads the data and places the object according to its XYZ coordinates, it is just a case that Z if forward and the top plane is X/Z.


- Steve

Hi Steve,

> SW reads the data and places the object according to its XYZ
> coordinates, it is just a case that Z if forward and the top
> plane is X/Z.

Right, that is exactly the problem - in a 3DM file the data is defined with the Top view of the data looking at the x and y axes.

If a different application uses different axes for its "Top" view, then it will need to remap the data it reads to make the object show up the same in their application. If they just read in x, y, z with no remapping the orientations will not match.

Usually most users expect for orientations to match, not just x,y,z themselves matching but with those axes going in different directions.

- Michael

Hi Steve,

> There is no re-mapping on export of iges from solidworks, it is
> just a case that in SW Y is up, Z if forward, the output is simply
> xyz co-ordinates, so when imported into MoI then Z is up.

This could be easy to verify if you could export something like a Cone that has a distinct orientation as seen from the Top and Front views.

If you could post an IGES file here output from solidworks, where the cone has a circular profile from the top, and a "pointed up" profile from the front, that would help to clarify this.

- Michael

Hi Michael,

>If you could post an IGES file here output from solidworks, where the cone has a circular profile from the top, and a "pointed up" profile from the front




- Steve

Hi Steve, well as you said there is no orientation change happening in the data there...

I'm kind of surprised as I have not had any complaints or seen any data files that were oriented in an unnatural seeming way.

Is it the normal convention for SolidWorks that the front view is supposed to be the "plan" view?

- Michael

Hi Michael,

>Is it the normal convention for SolidWorks that the front view is supposed to be the "plan" view?


As far as I remember, by default, yes.
I dont usually work in 3d based on names of views, but from the axis. Only if I was needing to take model to sheet would I take notice. That was really why I posted (some time ago now) about the colors of the main axis in the views of MoI not being correct, so now work just from the axis icons (which I can now increase in size, thank you).
When I do work in SW, I just rename the planes if I find a need, but usually just take orientation from axis/ model normals.

I hope you can see why I was a little confused by your adding the ability to change the axis, but then output to a global default, as that would certainly confuse me if I was to change axis layout and then work from that.


- Steve

Hi Steve....

I just reset my axis in moi to the default setting today....