CNC contours parts from 3D models

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 From:  grandpi (PIERREARCHI)
1990.1 
Michael,

Thank you again for the sketchup export format !!.Productivity will be very improved ...
A question of a CNC pro user : Do you think it could be possible to have a quick function in MOI to make flat parts contours on the "ground" axis from 3D models made of severals 2,5D parts (not complex volumes unfolded function as Lamina design software and without optimization of gap between parts contours on ground !). It will allow us to have a ready to cut file ready to export in 2D .Ai format in Vcarve or others cnc software. This function could be useful for furnitures builders, plane models builders, all kind of craftmen who produce something with 2,5D parts ...


Thanks.

Pierrearchi.

EDITED: 22 Sep 2008 by PIERREARCHI


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 From:  Michael Gibson
1990.2 In reply to 1990.1 
Bonjour!

It looks like you want a way to basically copy a planar curve from its current 3D location onto a flat plane?

I do want to add in a tool to make it easier to re-orient objects, I think it should enable making this process easier. I actually wanted to add that tool in for this most recent beta but I was not able to get to it yet. But hopefully for the next beta I can add that in.

- Michael
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 From:  grandpi (PIERREARCHI)
1990.3 In reply to 1990.2 
Thanks for the new beta Michael !!.
You resume perfectly what i could dream of ....
Thanks.

Pierre.
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 From:  grandpi (PIERREARCHI)
1990.4 
Michael,

Some future suggestions concerning this tool :

1) Could we have the possibility to determine as a value the gap between different 2D contour parts on ground? (linked with the thickness of the future cutting tool).
2) Is it possible to enter 2 values to determine a rectangle in which selected projected 2D profiles will fit into with an automatic scalling during projection? (linked with the future material size board).
3) A random button who could change the position of the 2D contours on the ground projection at each click mouse ?
4) Reverse button : A way to modify the 2D projected contours on ground who change in the same time the 3D object (real time or not)?
5) Having the ground projection 2d parts in an specific independant layer (who authorize spécials modifications).
6) A "way" to repeat a pattern/number/letter inside the perimeter of the 2D projected parts on ground. I have to think more precisely at this possible option !.

Bye,

Pierre.
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 From:  Michael Gibson
1990.5 In reply to 1990.4 
Bonjour Pierre,

Unfortunately I don't think that this orient tool that I'm thinking about will allow for any of that additional stuff such as labeling, spacing, or randomizing. It will just be focused on moving shapes from one orientation to be aligned with a different orientation.

All that stuff that you describe there would need a much more specialized tool targeted for CNC processing.

Unfortunately I don't think that I will be able to provide those types of CNC-specific tools in MoI anytime very soon, it is just not an area that I have a lot of specific background in. Additional stuff like that probably won't happen directly in MoI until a future version where some other developer adds those kinds of things as a plug-in. It is just not likely that I will be able to focus on that specific area myself anytime very soon, sorry!

- Michael
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 From:  grandpi (PIERREARCHI)
1990.6 In reply to 1990.5 
Hi Michael,

Could we have a "copy a planar curve from its current 3D location onto a flat plane" tool for the next beta. It will be enought for me and my job !.
A question to go ahead : In this tool, Do you think is it possible to make changes on the projection (projected curve on flat plane) and have modifications linked to the original 3d position curve (feedback option). A bit like a "parametric design software" in more less complicated ?. For exemple it will allow to check the link/silhouette between two flat profiles together quickly on 2D plan !. Hope it is clear . It could be useful for all users (not only cnc users). It could became a nice tool for 2,5D and 3D Designers ...


Thanks,

Pierre.

PS : In wikipedia, a parametric function definition for people who don't know : " ... This ability allows a user make a modification at any state and to regenerate the model's boundary representation based on those changes. This ability is called a transmigration operation ... ".
Please, a parametric MOI version in 5 years.... !!!!

EDITED: 27 Sep 2008 by PIERREARCHI

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 From:  Frenchy Pilou (PILOU)
1990.7 In reply to 1990.6 
a little schema or image for explain ? ;)
---
Pilou
Is beautiful that please without concept!
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 From:  grandpi (PIERREARCHI)
1990.8 In reply to 1990.7 
Salut Frenchy Pilou,

Il s'agit de pouvoir modifier automatiquement les profils des 3 objets dans l'espace sur la base de la deformation/transformation des silhouettes projetées automatique au sol par la fonction spécifique.

Les avantages (de mon point de vue ) :
- Ne pas avoir recours aux différentes vues de maniere intempestive.
- Tester des associations de contours de volumétries de manière plus simple.
- Tester des modes de fixations/liaisons entre objets d'après 2D au sol (pour utilisateur CNC et designers qui fabriquent (voir details des modes de fixation possible entre objet plan dans menu du logiciel Lamina design).
- Autres ... ?

Un déplacement au sol de la projection de signifie pas pour moi un deplacement équivalent dans l'espace d'un des composants de l'objet (peut être interessant ? ou optionnel dans menu de la fonction ?). Il s'agit d'évoquer la fonction de deformation/verification par feedback uniquement des jonctions de volumes (option dans le menu de la fonction) depuis leurs profils 2D au sol.

J'espere avoir été un peu plus clair. D'autre utilisations peut être ou pas d'intêret du tout ?

A+,

Pierre.

PS : Pouvoir choisir la distance entre tous les profils projetés au sol serait un plus, mais je crois que Michael ne veut pas en faire une fonction trop orientée fabrication.

EDITED: 27 Sep 2008 by PIERREARCHI


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 From:  Frenchy Pilou (PILOU)
1990.9 In reply to 1990.8 
Well, well :)
Maybe a very specific domain of modeling under constrain...a prog inside the prog...intricating...but why not;)
---
Pilou
Is beautiful that please without concept!
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 From:  Ray (WAGGONER)
1990.10 
Not being a French speaker I copied and pasted the earlier message from Pierre into Google Translate and got this reasonably accurate translation for any other users wanting to follow this fascinating thread.

Ray

>> Frenchy Pilou salvation,

It means being able to automatically change the profile of the 3 objects in space based on the deformation / alteration silhouettes projected automatic ground by the specific function.

Benefits (from my point of view):
- Do not use the different views of unintentionally.
- Testing associations contours of volumes in more simple.
- Test patterns attachments / links between objects from 2D ground (for CNC users and designers who manufacture (see details of possible ways of fixing between object plane in menu design software Lamina).
- Other ... ?

A trip to the basement of the projection does not mean I am moving in space equivalent of a component of the object (may be interesting? Or optional menu function). This is according to evoke the deformation / verification by feedback only junctions volumes (option from the menu function) since their 2D profiles on the ground.

I hope I have been a little clearer. Other uses may or may not matter at all?

A +

Pierre.

PS: Power choose the distance between all profiles projected ground would be a plus, but I think Michael does not want to make a too-oriented manufacturing.
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 From:  grandpi (PIERREARCHI)
1990.11 In reply to 1990.10 
Thanks Ray !. I'am definitively writing in french and translate after with google translation. After working 8 hours a day with google Sketchup, i 'm going to speak with google translation now: i'am going to make google dreams !.

Bye,

Pierre.

EDITED: 27 Sep 2008 by PIERREARCHI

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 From:  Michael Gibson
1990.12 In reply to 1990.6 
Bonjour Pierre,

> Could we have a "copy a planar curve from its current 3D location
> onto a flat plane" tool for the next beta. It will be enought for me
> and my job !.

I think there will be an Orient tool that will help with generally moving objects from one position to align with another, but I have not completed it yet so I'm not completely sure how it will work. But I think it will probably do this job.


> A question to go ahead : In this tool, Do you think is it
> possible to make changes on the projection (projected
> curve on flat plane) and have modifications linked to the
> original 3d position curve (feedback option).

Unfortunately that is a difficult task that would require a very much larger amount of work, so it is not likely that I'll be able to add that in to this tool at least not for quite a while.

I do want to make a better and deeper history update function, but here you are talking about the reverse type operation of editing the results and having the original update - the main focus for history updating is to update original objects and have the results update instead.

If you need to do this kind of a function, maybe one of the parametric solid modelers that are focused on this kind of stuff may be a better choice for you than MoI.

- Michael
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 From:  BurrMan
1990.13 In reply to 1990.11 
Your english is not so bad. The google translation was by far, for me, more confusing!

Just a note.
Burr
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 From:  grandpi (PIERREARCHI)
1990.14 In reply to 1990.12 
Hello Michael,

i know you are doing your best to satisfy all of us (MOI community)!.
Concerning the orient tool , will it be possible :

- to select differents contours together and orient them on choosed plan in one operation, one click .?
- an option to project contours only on ground plan ?

Thanks.

Pierre.

PS : This tool could change a lot my way of working (i will not have to draw again the same parts in another cnc software (vcarve) !!! Hours won !) that's why i ask too much questions about it !.

EDITED: 29 Sep 2008 by PIERREARCHI

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 From:  Michael Gibson
1990.15 In reply to 1990.14 
Hi Pierre, again I'm sorry MoI is just not currently targeted at being a CNC curve processing program, it is focused on doing modeling operations and you will probably need to find a different program that is focused on these particular kinds of CNC processing tasks instead of MoI, at least until the future at some point when someone else may be able to add more CNC focused commands into MoI as a plugin.

Given all the things that you really want it to do such as labeling, etc... I just don't think that I will be able to get anywhere close to the stuff that you have been asking about anytime soon.


> - to select differents contours together and orient them on choosed
> plan in one operation, one click .?

I'm not quite sure, I have not been able to work on the orient tool yet so I'm not quite sure yet exactly how it will turn out. But probably this will only work if the contours are all together on the same plane.

Maybe it will be possible for me to add in enough stuff so that a custom script command can be made that will be able to use some of the re-orienting tools in a more automated process like you want, but I'm not quite sure yet how much work that would take.


> - an option to project contours only on ground plan ?

Could you please describe this one some more? You can use the Construct / Curve / Project command to project a curve on to a surface, does that help any?

- Michael
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 From:  grandpi (PIERREARCHI)
1990.16 In reply to 1990.15 
Hello Michael,

I don't want to make MOI a CNC software but open it to an another (customers) community with just a nice script !

Two "automatics" actions in the same script :
- 1 The Z of the contour (or a contours group) in space 3D selected will become Z=0. (is What i call "on the ground plane" )
- 2 Contour (or a contours group) selected in space will be re-oriented to became "flat"(without dimensions distorsions) on the X and Y plan.

That' all !. If someone could explain the job with the existing project tool, it is ok for me !. i don't have good results with curve/projection tool.

Bye,

Pierre.

PS : Pour Frenchy Pilou : Il s'agit à travers un script et de la selection d'un contours dans l'espace 3D de le projeter à plat sur le plan XY avec un Z=O !. Ce n'est pas la mer à boire pour rassembler la communauté CNC autour de MOI...non ?

EDITED: 30 Sep 2008 by PIERREARCHI

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 From:  Frenchy Pilou (PILOU)
1990.17 In reply to 1990.16 
With only one selection 2 clicks, one rotation seems you obtain that you want ?

Seems a script can do that? (Rotate all selection, and the Scale 1D will be same result)

EDITED: 30 Sep 2008 by PILOU


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 From:  grandpi (PIERREARCHI)
1990.18 In reply to 1990.17 
Thanks Frenchy Pilou for this illustration !.
Some détails concerning the script close to your proposition :

- In fact, i just need contours to be projected, not surfaces.
- Possibility to rotate a group of contours in the same time : interest of a script.
- Possibility to rotate on 0,X,Y plane(ground) contours which are not in the X,Z or Y,Z plan (your exemple show object in the Y,Z plan, axes behind object make me think about it).

Bye,

Pierre.

PS : I could pay for this script if someone is interested !(around 50 Euros ).

EDITED: 1 Oct 2008 by PIERREARCHI

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 From:  Frenchy Pilou (PILOU)
1990.19 In reply to 1990.18 
In fact when you have your contours any rotates axis toward any plan takes one second by hands ;
No need script for that ;)

I am not sure of the Scale 1D ! I suppose vertices are stacked on a same positions but always exist?
Maybe this can be produce problem?
Depending of what is the folowing next step?
---
Pilou
Is beautiful that please without concept!
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