Well I have said I requested a similar feature in MOI several times... ;-)

-Will

Hi Will,

> Perhaps if you had a "roadmap" posted on the wiki where we could
> see some of your ideas on what you're planning to implement,
> <....>

It's kind of tough for me to do that because I don't really have a completely locked down roadmap and schedule.

My priorities and roadmap can change quite a bit as I am in the middle of working on stuff, as I get new ideas etc...

- Michael

Hi Petr,

> It would be nice if there was a second mutually exclusive mode
> (like Radius/Diameter) to make a Dir and Grid array, I mean we
> were able to set up a distance between two subsequent items of
> array (preferaby by clicking in the viewport) instead of setting a
> number of items; then drag a dashed line/window to multiply a
> number of items.

I guess I'm not really sold on that "dynamic drag to adjust number of items" type thing.

It just does not seem to me to provide a lot of value - especially for the commands other than Array Grid which allow you to change the number of items as a previewable option already. Like for example in Array Dir if you want 6 items just type in 6 <enter> and you'll get it, if you want one more, type in 7 <enter> and you'll have one more. I'm not really sure what waving the mouse around to move between 6 and 7 really gives you, I mean other than looking cool.

I do want to add a switch hopefully for both Array grid and array dir where the distance that you set will be used as the kind of "full set" distance instead of the "item cell" distance, that's kind of related so that may help get some of the feel for what you want to do there.


> (step 4 with bubble text - "tools snap according to predefined..." <...>
> Is it too complicated?

It kind of looks like that "predefined" distance comes from a whole pattern library mechanism that you use to set those patterns up beforehand.

Certainly that could be useful, but having the whole pattern library mechanism to implement along with that does make it quite complicated overall...

- Michael

Hi Michael,

>>I guess I'm not really sold on that "dynamic drag to adjust number of items" type thing.

okay, c’est la vie :)

>>I mean other than looking cool.

Instead of looking cool it's rather a way how to meet the target when I more or less know both an ofsset distance (or item cell) and a given room to fill in. It means the number of array items is unknown unless I calculate it before.

Petr

Hi Petr,

> Instead of looking cool it's rather a way how to meet the target
> when I more or less know both an ofsset distance (or item cell)
> and a given room to fill in. It means the number of array items
> is unknown unless I calculate it before.

Will Array curve work for this situation?

What you could do is draw a line for the "given room to fill in" part - draw the line for that full extent.

Then select your object, run Array/Curve, Pick the "extent line" as the path curve, then in the options, fill in the "Distance" entry with your offset/item cell distance and the count will be calculated for you automatically, it will fill in as many items as it can while traveling along that line in offset distance chunks.


For Array grid the equivalent thing I guess would be a kind of hatch pattern like fill? Is that the kind of result that you would be trying to get with that?

I guess the way it could work would be a "Fill extents" type button on the "Choose number of copies" stage. If you clicked that button then you pick a rectangle or box for the full extent, then you pick an individual cell with the mouse or enter cell spacing. I suppose the first corner of the cell would be locked to the corner of the full extents rectangle...

- Michael

Hi Michael,

>>Will Array curve work for this situation?

Hehe... yup. Actually, I used to make an array using Array/Curve command quite a lot. But I seem to have forgotten and stopped using this "array along a line trick" when command Array/Dir was added. So yes, it is what I was looking for. Although, I must draw a line first... but it's okay considering a frequency of using this kind of pattern-making.

>>...hatch pattern like fill? Is that the kind of result that you would be trying to get with that?

Yes.

>>..."Fill extents" type button on the "Choose number of copies" stage...

It sounds good to me - it might be better than drawing two or three lines as a path curves for Array/Curve command first.


Petr

Hi Petr, I think it would be easiest to tune up Array/Dir first, I think that definitely makes sense for it to be able to do the same job as Array/Curve with a line.

I'm thinking of a Mode: dropdown option that lets you switch it into 1 of 3 different modes:


1 - (same as current behavior) - you give a number of items and pick an offset. The full extent is a byproduct.

2 - You give a full extent and a number of items, and the offset distance is calculated as full_extent / (num_items + 1).

3 - You pick 2 distances, an offset distance and then a full extent distance. Items are placed by moving along the full extent in offset distance chunks until it runs off the end of the extent.

So I guess these modes could be named:

1 - Offset, Count
2 - Extent, Count
3 - Offset, Extent


Can you think of any other styles that would also be useful?

- Michael

Hi Michael,


>>Can you think of any other styles that would also be useful?

No. There are just three variables (full distance, cell distance, number) so each mode corresponds to one equation.

The third modes might be in reverse order - first pick a full distance then offset distance.

Petr

Hi Petr,

> The third modes might be in reverse order - first pick a full distance
> then offset distance.

I figured that would be closer to that fence tool in LWCAD, by picking the extent last the kind of dynamic action part would be seeing regularly spaced instances of your object appear, with more added as you moved your mouse further.

But I think there is a good possibility here to allow them in either order, I can just get 2 distances and take the smallest as the offset.

I'm thinking of picks similar to Scale1D here - first a base point, then a second point, which then defines an initial line. Then the third point will track along that line.

If the third point goes longer than the original line, the third point becomes an extent, if the third point goes shorter than the original line then the original line is the extent.

- Michael

Hi Michael,

>>I figured that would be closer to that fence tool in LWCAD

Yes. But the possibility to pick fixed full distance then be able to change an offset distance by dragging a mouse seemed more useful to me. It would be more Dir/Curve-like solution (definitely, I didn't ask you to think an additional way of making array out because of that "cool" part of LWCAD's fence tool. Fortunately, you understood.. :)

Of course, your idea of having both normal and reverse order for third mode is the "ultimate solution".

Petr

Hi Petr, I have implemented these array dir options for the next beta, they seem to have turned out really well, here is a demo:



The first one is the normal method same as v1. The next option is the "Extent, Count" one, where the 2 points are taken as the full distance and the offset is taken as offset = full_extent / (num_items - 1) (correction from what I wrote earlier).

Then the last mode is where you give 2 distances and the item count is calculated for you (and displayed in the options panel). Either start with the small distance as the offset, then move your mouse further to create as many copies as will fit in that longer distance, or start with the long distance first and move your mouse closer to the base point to reduce the offset and generate more copies within that extent.

That seems to pretty well cover this area.

- Michael

Nice ! simple, powerful.
Thanks Michael.

You're welcome Danny!

Actually another thing I forgot to mention before which is also ready for the next beta is the ability to type in formulas in any spot that is asking for a distance/radius type number.

So for example when you are drawing a circle for the radius you can type: 15/4*2 and the result 7.5 will be calculated for you.

When you're drawing a line, you can type: <360/12 to set an angle constraint of 360/12 = 30 degree angle snap for that line.


You can also use functions like sin, cos, etc... Any of the things available to the JavaScript "Math" object are available, like:

sin(PI/4) - Calculates the sin of 45 degrees - all trig functions take radian angles.

random() * 5 + 1 - Calculates a random number between 1 and 6.

sqrt(), pow(), round(), etc...


I think you had asked about that previously?

- Michael

This sound incredibly powerful - what a way to speed up your workflow (both array and on-the-fly calculations).

For the array improvements (brilliant) - maybe you could somehow implement those functions but along a path. Is this doable?

Hi Michael,

> I think you had asked about that previously?

Yes, I did and you've come back with exactly what was asked, WOW!!!

Now that's what I call power with ease, I did mention in that post that I was a lazy designer,
now with these new tools that smile of satisfaction has grown.

If only all software support/developers actually listened to their customer needs, what a better and less
frustrating computing world it would be.

Thanks again Michael great work, or should I say fun.

> For the array improvements (brilliant) - maybe you could
> somehow implement those functions but along a path. Is
> this doable?

Hi Bruce - actually the existing Transform / Array / Curve command is able to apply those same kinds of functions along a path.

When you use that array on curve command, the extent is fixed to be the length of the curve.

If you enter an item count, the offset distance will be calculated for you.

On the other hand if you enter an offset distance, the item count is automatically calculated for you by fitting as many objects as possible along the curve, its similar to the way as shown with the new options for Array Dir.

But there isn't currently a way to interactively adjust the offset distance by clicking on the curve, you just have to enter different values to adjust it instead of by dragging with the mouse. Tomorrow I'll take a look at what is involved in adding that, it may actually not be very difficult for me to add that in there. If I could add that it would then give Array curve the same kind of interactive adjustment feel.

- Michael

Hi Danny, great! I'm glad that will be useful for you.

In the future I also do still want to make that pop-up panel work as a calculator as well in addition to this. But that will be a fair amount more work to make that happen so that part will have to wait for some other time.

- Michael

Hi Michael,

> In the future I also do still want to make that pop-up panel work as a calculator.
> But that will be a fair amount more work to make that happen.

Yeh, you mentioned that last time, even if you don't get the chance, the math functions will be
great as they are but I guess you'll have to eventually make the popup function for the pen
tablet side of things.

Cheers
Danny

Hi Danny,

> but I guess you'll have to eventually make the popup function
> for the pen tablet side of things.

Certainly for that, but also in addition to that it should be possible for me to add a useful feature to the calculator style stuff to make it able to hold several different "memory slots" of numbers where you can store the results of a calculation that you may want to recall later on for use in other spots.

Eventually...

But yeah probably the new quick in-line formula evaluation will actually be more useful than the full calculator would be for just simple things.

- Michael

gee... hehe... very nice, Michael. Only one note...

You cannot change a direction of the array after picking offset or extent point for Offset,Extent mode (when tracking line appears)?

Petr