I guess I should explain that the original thing that pissed me off enough to start this thread was someone posting links to Plasticity advertising affiliate coupon codes after having been warned not to do that.

- Michael

Hey Michel, I've never been able to stand people complaining about Moi3D's bevels/chamfers in the past either, actually, I think I even posted something about it once, explaining that you could do bevels using surfaces too. So when I said Moi3D doesn't do bevels either, I was specifically talking about that model (crash1.plasticity), nothing more.
That said, I just tried again with the latest stable version, Plasticity 25.3.4, and I managed to reproduce the issue.
Anyway, I gave it another shot and was able to recreate the problem.

P.S.
I never badmouth other programs, I've never done it and I'm not about to start.

Cheers and happy holidays!

Hi pafurijaz,

re:
> So when I said Moi3D doesn't do bevels either, I was specifically talking about that
> model (crash1.plasticity), nothing more.

I see, sorry I misunderstood.

re:
> I was specifically talking about that model (crash1.plasticity), nothing more.

You can get it in MOI if you switch to the old Solids++ library and keep it smaller than the choke point:



re:
> Anyway, I gave it another shot and was able to recreate the problem.

Was that still in Linux or did you recreate it only in the Windows version?

- Michael

I don't have Windows, the last Windows I had was XP!

Here's another one, Plasticity 25.3.3 Windows, all geometry created in Plasticity.



- Michael

@pafurijaz,

re:
> I don't have Windows, the last Windows I had was XP!

So what about XNurbs, you just aren't able to use it?

The Plasticity web site has this:



It says XNURBS "STUDIO ONLY" on the front page. But this is not correct, it's not just "STUDIO ONLY", it's Mac and Windows Studio only which you have to look for in fine print elsewhere.

And for Indie version it says: "All essential 3D modeling tools" but it does not include XNURBS as well, right?

So is XNurbs an "essential 3D modeling tool" as the front page seems to describe or not essential as the indie version says.

Why create a division of "second class citizens" like this?

- Michael

I think it's the Xnurbs guys that didn't want their product to be available on the cheapest tier :S

So yes it's Studio Win/Mac only, which seems clear to me in the pricing comparison tab. (Looks like a bunch of users run win-Plasticity trough wine tho).

Now, something I really find misleading is this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jw5Rk8hqPU

(I’m not really sure it’s a good idea to make Michael angrier than he already is.)

It’s an old video, but I don’t think much has changed since then. Maybe it’s good enough to produce a render mesh, but topology-wise, the n-gons option relies on one of those methods that simply merge coplanar triangles, and it will always be poor quality. Combined with the fact that you can only export to .obj (one of the worst formats you could use with n-gons), it’s a very strange choice of priorities imho.

Maybe it’s because you can use that Blender bridge, but to me, that workflow feels cumbersome.

But I'm not gonna lie, looking at all the comments in that video's I'm wondering if their are blind ? hyped ? or if I'm too picky ... .. .

(Plasti vs MoI mesher)

No it's not on par, or sometimes better ... (same primitives count)

“”””” No it's not on par ””””””

He is “Happy with the quality!”

There you have it right there…..

That is the quincy magoo version of the mesher…..

“Results Look good enough”

@ PaQ, <...sigh...> "just as good, sometimes better" he claims.... ????

I would like to see any actual examples of that.

In reality I don't think I have seen even a single case where the Plasticity n-gon tessellation was better than MoI's .

If you're lucky, with certain kinds of models it can only be slightly worse.

On more complex models Plasticity's n-gon output becomes worse and worse with large amounts of wonky lines.

The difference is that in MOI's n-gon output, every single poly edge in the entire output is either along a trim boundary edge, or running along a surface's UV directions. There is literally not even a single polygon edge that doesn't belong to one of those categories. That makes the MOI n-gon output highly structured with a wireframe that is strongly aligned with the original CAD model.

The Plasticity generated mesh does not have that same structure to it, it will often generate edges that seem to be from an initial triangular tessellation.

MOI does not make an initial triangular tessellation, it makes an initial UV quad mesh and then with trim edges the quads are trimmed directly into n-gons. The only triangulation in MOI happens at the end if you want triangles where the n-gons get triangulated. This native n-gon meshing process is unique to MOI and not available in any commercial geometry library.

Some examples in MOI:





And same in Plasticity:





- Michael

Re: N-gon meshing - especially if there are a lot of holes in large surfaces you'll see a lot of triangulated looking lines in Plasticity's fake n-gon output.

MoI result:


Plasticity result:


- Michael

I remember this discussion went back 12+ years ago where you talked about working on just your viewport mesher for something like 4 or 5 years before you even started to put MoI together…

You mean you didnt just download openscenegraph and buy a couple components to copy and paste from?

Another one.

Hi Michael, how are you? Hope everything’s going well for you :)

I haven’t been hanging around the MoI forum for a while, so I’ve clearly missed quite a few things. But what really caught my attention was this strange thread I didn’t know about and that made me wonder a bit, the one titled “Michael’s Plasticity rants.”

First of all, just to be clear, I am not a Plasticity user.

So my question is, Michael: why a thread like that? Let me explain what I mean. Over all these years, you’ve always maintained a very clear and consistent approach on this forum, staying 100% focused on MoI and on your users.

Because of that, I’m honestly wondering what the purpose of a thread about Plasticity is, here in a space that’s dedicated to MoI. And above all, why you felt the need to speak (obviously for reasons you consider valid) so negatively about that software. I mean… in the end, why should you care about that software at all? If it’s poorly written, that’s the problem of whoever wrote it and whoever chooses to use it, right?

Maybe I’m missing something. Sorry if this sounds blunt, but ever since I saw the title of that thread, I’ve been wondering why something like this would come from such a serious professional like you. You really don’t need to speak badly about a so-called “competitor” to MoI.

Thanks, and I’ll also take the opportunity to wish you happy holidays :)

A number of reasons were provided in this thread:

20 Dec.
>Plasticity is the only one that started out by blatantly plagiarizing my work.

22 Dec.
>Well it's in an area that I find particularly irritating - I don't like it when I see poorly designed UX being praised. And especially when it is being marketed as good UX.

23 Dec.
>If you're going to copy my stuff, why not do a proper job of it?

25 Dec.
>I guess I should explain that the original thing that pissed me off enough to start this thread was someone posting links to Plasticity advertising affiliate coupon codes after having been warned not to do that.

FWIW, I really wish that this thread had existed when I was first researching Plasticity --- I'd've bought MOI instead --- will finally be making that purchase once I've got PayPal funds lined up .

As far as marketing goes, I've always thought that the video which Naomi Wu did was a great start, and am saddened for many reasons that that was not followed up on --- that said, I did watch (and plan to re-watch) the YouTube series: Tom Meeks - 3D design for fun and life / Noun and Verb method --- perhaps an updated version of that could be done for v5?

Or just put out a video noting that if you find Blender difficulty to use, Plasticity will be too and to instead try MOI?

@Will - yeah clearly my dislike of social media other than this forum has left a big marketing opening for copycats.

I guess I've finally figured out that I can at the very least make use of my own forum for some social media marketing.

The main function of the forum is for providing technical assistance to users. That aspect works best without arguments and flame wars, etc... so that's why it is a shock for some to see a combative attitude from me here. Usually I put a lot of effort into dampening that.

I will try to keep such things isolated into their own threads, I think that should work fine.

Thanks, - Michael

Hi Michael, greetings :)

I read the reply from the user @Will to my question, which was addressed to you :) regarding the reason for the existence of the thread “Michael’s Plasticity rants.”

I would like to thank @Will for the explanation. However, since I hadn’t followed the history of that thread from the beginning, I was curious about why it existed—especially knowing that this style of communication is absolutely not in line with your very professional approach, which you have always maintained on this forum dedicated to Moi users.

I believe I now understand the reason for that thread, and I 100% agree with what @Will wrote in his reply when he said (I believe quoting one of your messages):
"I guess I should explain that the original thing that pissed me off enough to start this thread was someone posting links to Plasticity advertising affiliate coupon codes after having been warned not to do that.""

I also believe it is extremely frustrating and disrespectful when some people use the space of this forum to promote other products, especially when those products may even be direct competitors to Moi.

I’m not familiar with the software “Plasticity,” but from what I’ve read, it seems to be simply a very poor, poorly made copy of Moi :)

I don’t know if that is entirely accurate, but in any case, I can understand your irritation toward that software.

Best regards, and all the best :)