Full Version: V4 beta Oct-17-2018 available now - SubD to NURBS conversion

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Hi Nico, I would like to make that possible in the future but not applying sub-d during import would require a new type of sub-d control mesh entity in MoI which will take time to implement. So that won't be possible in the v4 time frame.

The focus for v4 is just to get a reliable and high quality sub-d to NURBS conversion working as a starting point.

- Michael

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1)From a UI perspective why is OBJ import not part of the File>Import command?
2) The filesizes for these imported OBJs is quite large. Looking forward to some of the other options you mentioned with fewer edit points with the possibility of some editability or a lighter file size.

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Hi parel,

re:
> 1)From a UI perspective why is OBJ import not part of the File>Import command?

Because it's not a general purpose OBJ importer, it is only meant to import an OBJ file that is structured for sub-d smoothing. MoI itself exports .obj files that are set up only for rendering and not sub-d smoothing and so it could be confusing to have it on the regular Import command with different behavior than the Export command.

In the future I expect to add more Sub-d tools including more on the "Create" menu and then the UI won't look as odd as it does currently.


> 2) The filesizes for these imported OBJs is quite large. Looking forward to some of the other options you
> mentioned with fewer edit points with the possibility of some editability or a lighter file size.

In the next beta there will be an option to choose between Patch type "Fewer patches, more control points" (which is the current method) or "More patches, fewer control points". The second new style will make little patches around extraordinary vertices but regular areas of the mesh will have less control points. It will reduce file size a bit but not really too much.

I would not expect either of these methods to generate something suitable for NURBS control point editing. If you want to edit control points the ideal place to do it is in your sub-d modeling program before you generate the .obj file in the first place. Also the ideal way to make a lighter file is to use a lighter control cage for your sub-d object from the start as well.

In the future I want to add a new type of object into MoI for representing a sub-d control cage. Then the sub-d importer would make that type of object and you would be able to access the sub-d control cage points in MoI rather than only the converted NURBS object as it is now.

- Michael

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>In the future I want to add a new type of object into MoI for representing a sub-d control cage. Then the sub-d importer would make that type of object and you would be able to access the sub-d control cage points in MoI rather than only the converted NURBS object as it is now.

Wow... That would bring the game to a whole other level. I am already all over the subD coversion of the beta, but being able to control the result on the fly... I am very excited! But first things first!

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Hi nameless, yes really the primary thing I want to have for SubD is the ability to make fairly sparse sub-d cages directly in MoI. They would be particularly good for semi-organic things like vehicles.

But in order to have that the conversion from SubD to NURBS needs to make high quality results and the OBJ importer was the easiest way to get that part worked out initially.

- Michael

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Hi Michael,

that sounds like the dream, really.

2 thoughts from my short experience with the program so far:

- Understanding Clines is so very crucial to designing in MoI (and I am still not 100% there). The Clines lock script is also so handy that in my eyes it would justify it being visible somewhere in the interface. I
currently draw Clines by "faking" a line tool and then canceling. Is there a more straightforward way? Would a Cline construction mode button make sense?

- Is there a way to adjust the scale of an object being pasted during the axises adjusting face? (After you Ctrl+Shift+V it on an object's surface). I tried looking it up in the documentation but I couldn't find it. If
not, wouldn't it be very useful to be able to scale the object around its center projected on the snapping surface?

I was very hesitant to suggest these, as 1) I am quite new and I might be wishing for features that already exist due to ignorance and 2) I totally get the advantages of a very simple interface on first program launch vs an intimidating full featured UI. So I am just pointing these out just for the sake of feedback through the eyes of a new user!

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Hi Michael,
is it possible to increase the size of the colour palette.
I know there are more options in the V4 beta palette but the basic colour panels
are very small compared to V3.
Barry

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Hi nameless,

re:
> I currently draw Clines by "faking" a line tool and then canceling. Is there a more
> straightforward way? Would a Cline construction mode button make sense?

You could set up one of the Cline plug-in commands from here:
http://moi3d.com/forum/index.php?webtag=MOI&msg=1029.1
http://moi3d.com/forum/index.php?webtag=MOI&msg=1029.25

I do want to add an official persistent cline command in the future, I haven't figured out the details of how they should be selected yet though.


> - Is there a way to adjust the scale of an object being pasted during the axises adjusting face?
> (After you Ctrl+Shift+V it on an object's surface). I tried looking it up in the documentation but
> I couldn't find it. If not, wouldn't it be very useful to be able to scale the object around its center
> projected on the snapping surface?

There is not currently any way to do this directly inside the PastePart or Orient commands but I do think it would be a good thing to add.

- Michael

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Hi Barry,

re:
> is it possible to increase the size of the colour palette.
> I know there are more options in the V4 beta palette but the basic colour panels
> are very small compared to V3.

Which colour palette are you asking about, do you mean the Scene browser > Styles section? Or the one that pops out from the properties panel?

- Michael

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Hi Michael,
it’s the pop up properties panel.
Barry

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Hi Barry, can you show me what yours looks like?

Over here my v4 looks like this:


And my V3 one looks like this:


- Michael

Image Attachments:
PropertiesPanelStyleV3.jpg  PropertiesPanelStyleV4.jpg 

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Hi Michael,
this one.
Barry

Image Attachments:
Screenshot (271).png 

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ahoy,
v4(right one) seems actually bigger/larger than v3..at least on my screen..windows 10

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Hi Barry, hmm well that dialog is actually displayed by a Windows operating system call, it's a little different than other dialogs in MoI.

MoI v3 did make a custom template for the dialog that re-arranged things a bit like moving the custom colors off screen, I guess I also made the color squares slightly larger. MoI v4 just uses the default one given by Windows.

I guess it might be possible for me to have an option to use the same one as v3 did, I'll see about that.

- Michael

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Hi Marco,
this is mine on Surface Pro 4.
Cheers
Barry

Image Attachments:
Screenshot (271).png 

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ah i see. well, you've got a 3k device there, which might generate some scaling issues in win 10. i dunno if michael can adress this within the system call.

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Hi, I'm a new Mo-I user so please excuse me if this feature suggestion is covered in a plugin/script.

The idea is to add more snapping options in line curve drawing mode, which are sensitive to their nearby points.

For example:



-- so as the cursor adds a new point, Moi3d suggests an alignment point with similar vertical placement, drawing a dashed line like the one I've drawn in magenta. It could detect any kind of angled line extensions, as with the cyan dashed line.

I've used other programs with similar functionality; it is super helpful for fast construction. I realise you can do this by manually adding construction lines as in traditional tech drawing -- this is a faster alternative.

Cheers.

PS absolutely loving the interface design and functionality of this program. Great work Michael!

Image Attachments:
smart-align.jpg 

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Hi Tover, I'm glad you are liking MoI!

So the construction lines function is what MoI has for that kind of functionality. And just to make sure - that doesn't just mean drawing additional regular lines, you can create what MoI calls a "construction line" while you are in any drawing command by holding down the mouse and dragging away from the point of interest.

There is more information here:
http://moi3d.com/3.0/docs/moi_command_reference11.htm#constructionlines

Having such lines appear in an automatic way works well for sparse drawings when you are drawing just a few lines like you show there. But when things are denser it becomes frustrating because your working area fills up with snaps all over and it can interfere with freely placing a point. So to avoid that MoI is intentionally designed to not do those automatically, only when you generate a construction line which can be done with a quick gesture inside any drawing command.

- Michael

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Hi Michael,
For the SubD conversion feature is it expected behaviour that when the NURBS objected generated has a boolean subtraction performed on it in MOI the edges generated from that can't be filleted without errors?
I'm trying to work out if I'm making a mistake or just expecting too much from the feature.
Thanks
Andy

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Hi Michael,

thanks for the detailed response! Sorry, I hadn't got deep enough into the docs yet. The construction lines function is such an elegant approach to this concept.

Rock on,
T

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