hi, thanks now I know I'm not crazy. what you found makes sense based on my experience with rhino. I had to fight with it a long time before I got it to work. and it all boiled down to tolerance settings and mesh options mostly.

I see moi is way better in a lot of ways and can really save some time if I can figure it all out. you came up with a really smart solution I wouldn't have thought of, scaling up and then back down. I should mention all points are in meters.