Hello,

I think the Problem of These discussion is the different Point of view about the meaning of design. I'm not a designer, but I think we have to clearify and find a consence about the meaning of some Terms. Here some non-binding proposals:

* product design - concepts and geometrical shaping of a product with respect to function, usability, production, matierials, estetic, communication/ iteraction with the user, haptics, Emotion,....
* estetic Styling - estecic of the form, colour, surface structure,...
* functional Styling - form follows function - depending on concepts (integral - differential design)

I had worked 14 Years for an automotive supplier and I've never heard something about Sub-D there(O.k. in Catia are a lot of Buttons;-). It may caused by the history of the companies. But I had a lot discussions about curvature stuff. I often get Models made or smoothed with ICEM. Some drafts came from ALIAS. The Styling with this Tools is a hard peace of cake (told the colleages that worked with ICEM, - No Designers!)- and very Special. I know something about the specifications for the Styling and the dataquality (Q-Checker:()
Sometimes I had to work at some blends for hours. So I don't understand the discussion about effective Styling/shaping not. For automotive styling you have to fullfill exactly some specifications and the wishes of the designer. Everybody can make a choice who he is and what he will do with Moi.

I like the contributions about other Tools and Software thank's for that to all- but a discussion about the matial arts of Chuck Norris v.s. Jean Claude van Damme in the forum of harmony is in my opinion obsolete.

Kind regards
Karsten

"Language shapes the way we think and determines what we can think about."
Benjamin Lee Whorf